A Deeper Look at Existence with Christian Sundberg

Hello and welcome to Get Yourself Optimized. I'm your host, Stefan Spencer. It is my pleasure to have Christian Sundberg with us. When Christian was a young child, he remembered his existence before coming to Earth. While that memory left him completely for his early adult life, it spontaneously returned 12 years ago as Christian took up a meditation practice and went through a personal awakening journey. He also began to have out-of-body experiences. Christian now often speaks publicly as he seeks to remind others of a small part of who we are beneath that human play. Professionally, Christian has worked for 16 years as a project manager for complex nuclear pump and valve manufacturing projects. Christian is the author of the book A Walk in the Physical, which attempts to subtly describe the larger spiritual context in which we exist and the importance of love in our human journey.

Christian, it's so great to have you on the show.
Thank you, Stefan. It's wonderful to be here.

Yeah, so first of all, I'd love to have you share your origin story of how you came to realize you were different from most people and how that affected your life.

Sure. Well, we're all different. We're all very different and unique. But yeah, so when I was a small child, I had pre-birth awareness. I remember choosing this life and why, and then that memory left me completely by the age of five or six. It returned spontaneously at the age of 30. So I'm not going to share that experience in detail. I've shared it many times, but you know, since that experience and since the out-of-body experiences I had starting around the same time and over the last 13 years, I just see the world differently than probably the average person. I'm aware that this is an experience we're having. This is an experience that's occurring within consciousness, within what we really are. We're not really human, actually. We're just having the human experience and through it, integrating this experience and learning and growing and becoming more, working our way, you could say, towards love, using the contrast of the human condition for the expansion of love and the working past of fear. So that's super high level, but yeah, I see the world in that way, and I'm aware on a daily basis that we're not just the humans. We're actually much bigger.

Yeah, so what happened when you were age five or six, and that memory left you? Was it a certain moment or certain event that coincided with the loss of that memory, or was there just a gradual kind of slipping away of that memory? What happened?

Yeah, it's more the latter because the veil, so that means the constraints we agree to accept and wear while we are human, the veil functions in such a way that our larger nature is obscured. And then the more we focus into the physical, the more we get of the physical. So you know, as I aged, I learned all the conditioning of a young child—my name and who I was and what I was supposed to do and not supposed to do. And the more we focus on that story and learn that and associate into that, that deepens the veil, you could say. So that was just a gradual process. I think it's very natural. I think everyone actually is closer vibrationally in consciousness to the other side at the very beginning of life because we haven't become so form-associated. But as we grow in form association, it's quite normal here to completely forget, at the conscious human level, what we really are. That's just part of the game, actually.

Yeah, so who are we, and who are you, and how does that show up in your daily life?

Yeah, who we really are is vastly beyond language. It can't be spoken of because it's spirit. It's consciousness, awareness itself, beingness, life with a capital L. And that, whatever that is, that consciousness, it fully transcends all form, all language, all distinction, all description, all duality, actually. So you know, we can't take a word or two or five or 100 and successfully describe consciousness, but that's what we are. But metaphorically, to use some metaphors, we could say that each one of us is like a drop in the great ocean of all that is, or more specifically, a drop in the ocean of source, what we very crudely call God. That is the great I Am, that is the root of all things. We are each a drop in that ocean, and we could say that each drop is a soul. Soul just meaning an individuated consciousness. I like the term that Tom Campbell, the physicist and consciousness explorer, uses. He uses the term "individuated unit of consciousness" (IUC) for the soul. I like that. It's accurate. We are individuated beings, but yet simultaneously one with the whole. See, that's really important because here on Earth, we've come really deeply into the experience of separation. And as we feel distinct, completely separate from each other and from the environment, we think, "I'm just me. I'm just in this body. This body is all I am." We don't feel consciously on a day-to-day basis that we're actually one with everyone else and everything else. In higher systems, that knowing is quite normal—to sense that others are a part of us and we are a part of them, and the environment is a part of us. So yeah, in short, we are each souls, and the soul has many, many different experiences and many unique qualities. And so we're each very, very unique, even though we've all come here and kind of met in this place on Earth, having this human experience at this time.

So do you remember past lives? Do you remember, for example, that we've met before or that you feel any sense of connection with me?

I feel connection with you. I feel connection with many because, especially those who are of clearer awareness, you know, as the form association is not as firm, it's easier to feel the living connection. But anyway, yes, to your question, I have some brief memories of other physical experiences. I've had some snippets, some details. They're not other people, you know. It was just me doing other things, being other people, same me, same I. So I'm aware of that. But sometimes I got curious and tried to go down that path, and I can feel this gentle nudge like, "No, you don't need to go there right now." And that's fine. You know, I'm doing this thing now, this human experience now, so I try to stay rooted in just this character at the moment. But yeah, I'm aware that we are much more than just this character that we play, and that connectedness that you mentioned, I do feel that with others every day.

So do you receive stuff telepathically from others that you don't have to communicate through voice, or do you just get a knowing? How does the information show up for you?

Yeah, those two things are pretty synonymous—telepathy and knowing. Yeah, so I do feel that. It's hard to describe this, but it's a perception of non-physical awareness. You know, I feel my energetic connection with others, and so I may feel what's going on with them as the human or who they are more often. Actually, I feel more like who they really are, who is shining through the human character. It's like if an actor puts on clothes and plays a role, you never really can get past them being that actor. Like Robin Williams is a great actor. Every movie he's in, you know, it's Robin Williams just playing these other roles. I kind of see and feel energetically people like that a little bit. You know, like we're the soul playing through this given character and through its story and form associations. And yeah, we're all connected, and that connectedness is just supernatural. It's available to all of us when we sufficiently let go of the form association and what we're not. It's just what we are. You know, that connectedness, that aliveness, is always there, even though typically while we're veiled in the human experience, like I said, separation is such a deep part of this experience. We typically don't consciously perceive that at the human level, but that is changing. It's on the rise as we grow in awareness. We do grow in that conscious awareness and feeling of that connectedness with each other and of each other's natures.

So how does this show up? Give us an example of a scenario where you have gotten some extra-sensory perception, some sort of knowledge or insight or information that allowed you to communicate in a more or to achieve an outcome that wouldn't normally have been possible with somebody that maybe you just met.

So sometimes I do one-on-ones with people. I'm usually very busy, but I love it. I love doing it when I can find the time to really spend time, and sometimes I'll meditate and kind of feel into who they are. So as an example, I have a lot of examples, but I'll just mention one. So this is one that has a very specific, tangible, physical result. So I guess I'll mention this example. So years ago, I was interacting with someone online who I just felt intuitively was a part of my soul tribe, you know, my family, the souls that I know so well that are very resonant with me. And I had never met her physically, but I was just so familiar with her energy. And I was highly meditated at the time, that period in life, and so I was very connected to spirit. And one day at work, I went for a walk behind my workplace up this hill, and I felt this non-physical dialogue with her. Her higher self is the word we use—that is the portion of her that is bigger than the human. I know this sounds wild. I know what I'm sharing sounds wild, but I felt this connection with her, and she gave me this energetic gift of this healing feeling down my spine, and it was really wonderful. And it was accompanied with this recognition of who I am, and I was like, "Wow, that's really beautiful. Thank you so much." And then she told me telepathically, "See that piece of moss on the ground right there? Pick that up, take that back to your desk, and tell the human me about that, and it being a sign of a gift." Like, "Okay, you know, because I try to remain skeptical about these things too. It's important to remain grounded, of course." But I took this moss back to my desk and thought, "What the hell?" So I reached out to her, and I said, "I'm pretty sure that your higher self just gave me this energy experience as a gift and then told me to bring this piece of moss back to my desk. What does that mean to you?" And she said, "I kid you not, last night I said to my husband that the perfect example of a gift that someone could give to me would be a piece of moss." And it was like, you know, that's pretty awesome. You know, when that kind of thing happens, typically it's a more personal connection. Like I'll just feel energetically who they are and what they're experiencing to some degree. You know, if I'm really form-focused, like if I've been working all week and I haven't meditated as much, that sense diminishes significantly. But if I'm clear and alert and feeling present and not cluttered in my consciousness, then I might feel all sorts of things from them—like maybe what they're dealing with in their life or what assumptions they've got mixed into the structures they've built as a human and true natures, you know, like true qualities of the soul. We each have so many unique qualities as souls, and they're very unique, very specific to each person. They're very beautiful, and so I find it's just amazing and wonderful to feel into that and to experience that and share that with someone and find and see a little "wow" of who they are here, even while we're here. Yeah, so that's difficult to describe. I know that doesn't sound too specific, but I guess the best outcome for that would simply be that I feel that sometimes I've been able to help people, you know, if they're at a place where what I might suggest would be helpful sometimes.

So do you get a sense for some of the unique qualities of my soul? You feel clear and meditated enough to do that? You want me to share that on the air?

Of course, of course. To give it justice takes time. I need to spend time dwelling into the vibration of the person, but I can simply say you have a great kindness. It's very unobstructed in a way that's unusual, and the energy that I feel from you feels wide in a way, like it's sitting almost outside of you in a way. Because a lot of people have kind of a very protected, internalized thing. You're not really so worried about that. You're kind of—I don't like to use the terms "aura" too loosely here, but it feels like the aura would be large, wide, because your energy is just kind of out there. For me, it's like a white—I mean, so when we perceive these things, we get if there's going to be words or colors or specific form as an expression, it tends to be in our own experience language. So if somebody tells you a color, that doesn't mean that's the color that you are necessarily. It means that color might mean something to me. So I feel from you like a pale white, which is kind of a simple, pure, simple in a good way, pure willingness to be loving and caring and open, but maybe a little bit perplexed by the taller structures in the world that might try to step on you. Something like that energetically.

It's awesome. Yeah, I resonate with that. Now, if you work with somebody on a longer session, one-on-one, what sort of insights do you get on the soul of that person that maybe they could apply in their day-to-day life immediately?

Yeah, I can't claim any actionability because it's so—first of all, my own state will very much affect how clearly I'm able to sense what I sense. And then, if they're vibrationally—as beings, we have familiarity with certain vibrational qualities. Like we know certain things, we've experienced certain things, we could even say we've mastered certain things, and then we ourselves have our own vibrational quality. So that means that when we interact with the vibration of another, there may be portions of them that we can't even really understand, I guess would be the best way to put it, and others that might be very resonant. So there are some individuals with whom I feel strong resonance, that I feel that sensing from them energetically is very easy, while with others I might not feel so resonant, and the sensing is not as easy. So anyway, all I can do is to offer what I sense in case it is helpful to them, simply to remind them if it's helpful because I don't claim to have any special knowledge. That's not how this works. If it's helpful to just kind of remind them who they really are because a lot of us get lost within the form association. We get lost within the negative stories, within the fear patterns, within the pain, within the trauma. Right? So there's a lot of people who are wrapped into trauma, and then they forget that they're really a being of deep kindness, as an example, because of all the trauma. They become very prickly or something. You know, that's okay. That's fine. But then to remind them, "Oh my gosh, you really have a lot of kindness," and it might be so natural to them to feel that kindness, but it's been lost in trauma so long ago that might not be helpful. So I can't claim any specific outcome. I can at least say that.

Okay, so then there's another layer. I don't mean to make this sound even more mystical because I like to stay grounded about these things, but there's also an energetic exchange. So sometimes I've been able to interact with somebody non-physically in a way that I feel is helpful. So even though they might not be consciously aware of it, there could be like a way to nudge or interact with the energy body in a way that is useful. Everyone, we're on Earth right now, so because we're on Earth, we have an advantage for each other that the guides don't necessarily have, and that is we're all local. So we've all got a similar resonance. We're all like in the lower vibrational realm of Earth, whereas guides are very high vibrations.

So for them to interact with us, it can often be tricky. So our advantage here is that if we can offer a vibration of love and support to each other here, it can be really effective and potent because we're both at the dense level. So our resonance is not as far. I don't know if I can describe that well.

Gotcha. Okay, yeah, that's a very personal question you asked, and I'm not sure. There's so many ways I could speak to it, and you know what I mean? It's like it's so hard to speak to, and I don't consider myself like I don't consider that to be like a main thing that I do. I just really enjoy doing it because connecting with other people is joyful—really connecting, really feeling each other, feeling our sharing our vulnerabilities and our joys and where we really are. That's joyful. That's like our true nature always shares for real, not the fake stuff. So I just really enjoy doing that, but I don't claim to be any kind of psychic or medium or even an energy worker, even though I do work with energy. I wouldn't label myself in that way.

That's cool though. I had a session once with Arya Lauren. I learned about her from Mindvalley, from Vishen Lakhiani. So I did a session with her, and she looked in my eyes and said, "I just see so much love there." She looked into my soul—like eyes are the windows to the soul—and when she looks in people's eyes, she connects with who they really are, and she saw so much love, and I just loved hearing that. You know, it's just validating because that's exactly the word I was trying to look for.

Yeah, validating. That's exactly the word. Yeah, I mean, I think it's apparent. I think that people can see it on the surface even if they're not energetically sensitive, but we only see the physical result, whereas the energy of who someone is—like, you know, like, PE individuals may be masterful as souls in certain ways. You know what I mean? So like, you have a masterful quality in a way that's like kindness and love that is obvious, but that doesn't mean that you're necessarily masterful at other things.

It's just how it is. You know, we learn and we grow, and so for us, like I feel like one of the main things we do on Earth actually is coming to walk on our weak leg or to deepen a strength by knowing its opposite. In both of those cases, we take on something that's very alien to us, very challenging to us, in order to expand, in order to grow. So like, a challenge for me might not be a challenge for someone like my wife. There's certain things that are challenges for me that are not at all a challenge for her, and vice versa. That's okay. That's how it is.

Well, it's a big challenge for you that you're going through now.

Well, I mean, the main fear that I came to process in this life has some depth to it. I've processed so much, so it's complicated. Fear is a complex topic. At this current moment in my life, my current struggle is trying to come to terms with navigating really two types of work. One is mainstream work, you know, within the mainstream business environment and the energies of that environment, and the other is the spiritual sharing work. For me, I feel I want to be responsible for my family, so I do the former, and I don't charge anything for the latter. I don't ask for money.

So you know, I've chosen to work to earn money and then to just try to give away what I can in the teaching work, but there's a cost. There's an energetic cost to that in order to remain sensitive. And remaining sensitive in an environment of bureaucracy and inauthenticity at times and politics and all the energetic demands of having many hours of meetings in a day—that's very challenging for me on a day-to-day basis.

So I would say at the current time, that's probably the main thing that I struggle with because I'm trying to really play the human game all the way and not be afraid to do what's hard. It is hard for me to actually do both. I only have certain physical resources. I have health challenges other people may not have, and I have energy limitations, especially because I'm so sensitive. Like I feel like when you have high sensitivity and when you process a lot of information when you're open to spirit, it means that everything might like routine action can be wider bandwidth and might require more energy. So I definitely fall into that category, and that makes day-to-day demands potentially challenging for me.

Gotcha. So when you're connecting with people, you're connecting with nature, with animals, with all that is, do you find some of that to be draining and that lowers your energy, or no?

No, no, that's very rejuvenating. Right now, the connection of spirit is rejuvenating. What I find draining is you could think of it like vibrational resonance in simple terms because I have to resonate down into the mean vibration, meaning the average or the middle, the median vibration of a place or a group or a company or whatever, in order to really be there and interact. At least that's been my experience, and that can be draining for me because I'm energetically sensitive and because I really feel everything and I really am processing it all. So there can be a challenge there. But now returning to the connectedness is wonderful and peaceful and life-giving. You know, when I do a session with someone or even when I do a talk like this, I feel rejuvenated. I feel strengthened by it.

Yeah, you know, it's all learning. You know, I'm going through my lessons too on all this, and what I found to be helpful, rejuvenating, and reconnecting is while I'm in the midst of something that could be difficult or lower vibration, I just wave at God in a metaphorical way, using my third eye. Imagine like an emoji of a wave or hands together emoji of thank you, just to keep a connection going so that I can be in both worlds simultaneously—this world and the upper worlds.

One comment that comes to mind as you say that, since you invited the intuitive share, is to be cognizant of any negative self-perceptions that you are assuming are real as the challenges arrive.

So give me an example of that.

So if you have a challenge that arises and it makes you feel bad, you might actually be buying into a perception of powerlessness or unworthiness without even recognizing it. And then it's when we buy into the negative self-perceptions that fear rises, you know, and then the ego and all the shenanigans rise out of that. But the negative self-perception at the root is actually not true. Like as spiritual beings, we are powerful, completely free, loving, joyful, creative. That is our true nature. We're completely worthy. We're completely free. We're more powerful than we could possibly imagine. So if we're in a low vibration environment, we don't have to meet them where they're at. We can just show up with our light, and then everything changes. You know, we're not changing them. We're just changing everything.

I absolutely agree with that. If we can show up with the presence and with our own—I don't like using the duality terms "higher" and "lower," but higher vibration—if we just arrive with the higher vibration, that is actually a service. But what I meant by the draining aspect is more very specifically in my case. So if you go to an environment, whether it's physical or non-physical, that has a certain average vibration, it tends to pull you into it. That's all I'm saying. Even the collective consciousness of humanity, especially the collective consciousness of humanity, has an average vibrational level, and it's actually very low by comparison to the higher realms.

So like, that's one of the reasons why peak experiences tend to wane. You know, if we come up and have this amazing state or a near-death experience and feel the love and the connectedness, over time we tend to return back to the more mean vibration, the average vibration of Earth, because we're a part of the vibrational system, and the vibrations tend to equalize. But actually, that's also why we're providing a valuable service by being higher vibration. Actually, by being present with more love, more openness, more authenticity, that is pulling—I don't know what the right word is—it's coaxing, even, you could say, the average vibration up and helping to free it. I don't want to make it sound like though that the negative is like a real thing. It's not.

There's not really a duality going on. It's actually pure love and joy and peace that has temporarily lost itself in association with something that is not. It's important to put in this context because I'm not saying there's like a real spectrum, but what we're doing here is losing ourselves in that form. You know, that's like the name of the human game is believing, "Oh, I'm just a job," and "Oh, this person did this thing to me," and "Oh, I don't make enough money," you know, whatever those perceptions might be, and then losing our identity in those perceptions.

And then we get our self-worth tied in, and you know, we don't actually need to do that. But I'm not saying it's easy to identify that and to feel it. It's one of the reasons meditation is so important, by the way—not to change topics too many times in one response—but meditation can really help us to find underneath all those stories that we think are so important today, all the denseness, we really already are peace and joy right now.

It's very hard to like if you're in the thick of it and you don't have that experience of being peace and joy, it's hard to imagine when you hear somebody talk about it.

Yeah, it can even piss you off.

Yeah, the ego. The ego can even get really ticked off when someone says that, right? Because, "No, I'm mad. I'm angry. I'm miserable. Don't tell me that's nice and peace and joy. I got pain. Yeah, how dare you?"

Yeah, how dare you tell me that I'm love and peace and joy. I mean, it's kind of ironic because it's interesting when you share a message of unconditional love, a lot of ego responses may rise up, but unconditional love is the truth. It's the truth. But anyway, that's okay. It's okay that that happens. If you notice that in yourself, which you know, it happens, just notice in yourself, "Well, how do you think you don't have that? How do you think that life has proven to you that you're not worthy or that you're not free or that you're not joyful?" And then be brave enough because it takes bravery, willingness, humility to actually go and feel that pain that you felt, to feel that negative self-perception, to feel the trauma, to heal it by going into it and saying, "You know what, I actually do feel this way. Wow." You know, that's owning your own crap. When you do that, that takes a certain quality of intention to do that.

Something you said earlier I just want to circle back on, and you mentioned the word "skeptical." Try to stay a little skeptical, grounded. I don't consider those terms synonymous with each other, by the way. They're two different things.

Yeah, they're different, but yeah.

And actually, I consider skeptical pretty low vibration, and if I dare say, even almost to the vibration of cynical. I would draw a significant distinction between skepticism and cynicism.

It's almost like they're two sides of the same coin, though.

I think that's my personal—okay, we can create a new neutral term for skepticism that means simply that you don't take things, you don't believe things immediately, and that you try to discern what is real and what is not. That's important. That's important to do.

I hear where you're coming from, but I've got something here that maybe try it on for size, see if it fits. It's an expression I forgot where I heard it from, but it's "the willing suspension of disbelief," and I really resonate with that. I used to consider myself a skeptic, but now I feel like, "Ah, this fits me much better—the willing suspension of disbelief." So I'm not immediately discounting or looking at something with skepticism. I'm open-minded about it. I'm not immediately trusting it, but I've suspended my disbelief. What do you think?

Yeah, so I'm reminded of the mantra, so to speak, that Tom Campbell lives by when it comes to these topics. He says it's important to remain open-minded and skeptical. Open-mindedness is the suspension of disbelief. That's important too, but they're both important, you know, because we need to be open-minded, but we also need to be willing to discern. That can actually be really important even as we self-explore internally and even as we meditate because the ego wants a quick fix.

It wants a quick answer. "Tell me what to believe so I can feel better. I just want to believe something so my fears are washed away." Whereas it's okay to pause and say, "You know what, I actually don't know if that's true. I actually don't know if I live after my physical body dies, for instance. I actually don't know if what I believe is real or not." That's scary, but it's important because if we're not willing to actually question, then we may not go and actually seek and explore the reality.

And the reality is really good news. Like, at the bottom of everything, it's total peace and freedom and love and joy. It is. But until you get there, it's okay if you're like, "Okay, I don't see that on the surface. I want to go find out." Go into the dark closet and find out. Test reality. Test your own consciousness. Test your association with form, with beliefs, with identity, with story. Go spend the time looking at that, and that requires both open-mindedness and whatever this new word that we can create is—like, yeah, skepticism in that context. I like discernment. You mentioned discerning.

Discernment. Yeah, it requires discernment. You know, it's fun. You know, each word has a corresponding vibration, or maybe it's the vibration has a corresponding word. I don't know which way it goes, but the difference between gratitude and appreciation is a vibrational frequency. So if you're in gratitude, that's different from being in appreciation, and if you're in appreciation, that's different from being in gratitude. And I try to be in both.

Yeah, that's really cool that you say that because there's a—so absolutely, and there is a—okay, spirit is ridiculously subtle and good at navigating broad spectrums of differentiation in vibration, in meaning, in feeling. It's very rich and nuanced, very nuanced. So of course, one word to another and how it's been used over human history is going to have a different vibration. I mean, our whole collective consciousness has many, many forms that it's built up—beliefs, languages, symbols, words, you know, whatever that are in the collective that have meaning, and those meanings might even shift and change. You know, like for instance, I suspect—let's just take something silly like the acronym "LOL."

You know, that has a different vibrational meaning to it, vibrational nature now than it did 20 years ago because of all the history that's gone into it. And some symbols have lasted with us for thousands of years, and even their meaning has shifted or become its own thing. Like in the astral, a thought form can become its own mass, you know. So you might take an idea like Jesus or something, you know, and you've got the man, the being Jesus, and then you've got the thought form of the belief in Jesus, and even Christianity—those are different thought forms. They might not be exactly the same thing, but anyway, so that's just a lengthy comment to your comment about different words having different vibrations. They definitely do. Every thought, every intention actually has its own pitch.

Yeah, it's very nuanced.

Can you describe for our listener a thought form?

Yeah, so okay, I'll use a metaphor to try to depict this because I know thought form might seem abstract. Okay, so one time I was in a meditation circle, and a woman in the circle said something about China, which has meaning to me because I lived in China earlier in this life, and I was in a meditative state, and I saw and heard and felt her thought about China reach around the world and touch all that was China. I could see, I could perceive it. It had an energetic mass, you could say, to it.

So it was like a thing. It was like a stone or something that was thrown around the world, so to speak, energetically, and I was like, "Oh my gosh." I knew intellectually that thought form was real and had mass, but I perceived it very directly, very tangibly. It was like, "Oh my gosh, like every one of our thoughts and intentions is doing this." So in higher realms and thought-responsive realms, we tend to get thought forms presented to us that match vibrationally, you know, wherever we are, whatever we're expecting, whatever we believe, whatever language, whatever the experienced language needs to depict to us using those forms. So thought form, you could just think of it like an object that has a mass or momentum that is a thought or an idea. And certain ideas or thoughts have been repeated so much that they have substantial mass in the human collective consciousness.

Gotcha. And in astral realms, that may transcend even the human collective consciousness because we're actually—not to sound too abstract here—but we're actually creating. One of the creative acts we're doing here without even knowing it is adding to thought form, like adding to the thought form library, you could say, just by living a novel experience, you know, in creating things, inventing things.

And actually, that reminds me of one other thing. If you can have even—I know this is going to sound really tangential, but it's pertinent too—if you in your whole lifetime have one novel thought or one novel feeling that the all that is has never known before, your whole life has been worth it because you have added something to all that is—some newness, some depth. We're on the leading edge of creation, as Abraham likes to say. Abraham Hicks. We are this is the lead frontier. This is the messy, cool, hard, in-your-face, rigorous, high-value, high-efficiency but potentially apparently destructive frontier.

Yeah, creative destruction. It only appears like destruction, but yeah, but it's all beautiful, and it's all perfect, and divinely orchestrated, but we don't see it sometimes.

Be lucky to get a glimpse of it.

Yeah, so I wouldn't use the word "lucky." I'd be sensitive to that because that implies that no, you're just stuck being just a human.

About words and vibrations, right? So "lucky" is not the right word to use. "Fortunate" is a better word. That's a better vibration.

But even that—yeah, your higher self sees. The higher self, the higher portion of you, already sees very clearly. You could think you are already up on the cliff looking over the whole forest, even though you're down in the trees. You just might not be consciously aware of it at the human level because that's the name of the game, and you got lost in the trees. But if you let go of the trees all the way, the beautiful higher view arises on its own.

So when you have thoughts and you formulate words from those thoughts, and there are vibrations that are associated with those thoughts, and you're trying to communicate telepathically to somebody—whether it's a human or a being, a non-physical being, or it's an animal—you know, animal communicators who are very successful at this, they communicate telepathically to the animal. We unknowingly do it with our pets. You know, like, "I'm taking her to the vet today," like I didn't do or say anything different, and she went and hid in the closet. Right? They know. They know.

So how do you communicate with animals using your abilities? Any awesome stories to share in that front?

No awesome stories in that area. I do have a tree nearby in my house that I very much like to hang out with. It's half dead, but it's quite vibrantly alive energetically. Anyway, so this might be going a bit deeper than what you were asking, but it's pertinent. So the fundamental substrate of what is is consciousness itself, spirit itself. And what is spirit? It's connected. It's all one thing. It's one. Okay, so then what does spirit do? It intends.

So that means it moves in some way, and intention precedes all form, actually. All realities, all thought, then it works through thought, it works through realities. You know, I can then make, I can wield an intention and decide what to do in this context. Yes, every day we do that many, many times. Okay, so the reason I'm saying that is simply that intention is the active ingredient both for manifestation and for telepathic communication because you could say, to put it in a metaphor, we're all connected to the same database, and the higher self is looking at the database all the time, all of us. So we're sending messages to each other even if we're not consciously aware of it.

Yeah, sometimes I might have a non-physical experience while my body is sleeping where someone will give me a message, and I don't know why. You know, sometimes it's completely not—I can't tell why it's relevant, maybe it's not relevant, at least in a way that I recognize. But we are always connected and communicating with each other all the time. So I'm just saying that because the way you know, telepathy is the normal communication when we're not constricted to the physical and having to throw sounds at each other, which is a ridiculous, inefficient process.

In higher realms, we dump exactly what we're thinking and feeling and get exactly what we're thinking and feeling or what they're thinking and feeling, and it's very full, very complete, like a whole book at once. It doesn't need to be like word, word, word, word. It's like no, exactly. And it's more about what you're actually experiencing and what I'm actually experiencing. So I'm saying all that in context to your question because when we wish to telepathically exchange, it's as simple as dropping our own form association and issuing intention towards them.

And that intention might be through a thought, through a message, and the more focus and clarity we have with it, the more clear it is, the more pointed it is, and that's how manifestation kind of works like that too. Reality is always listening to us too, and our intention is what's nudging the probabilities all the time versus like ego thought-mongering. They don't have much oomph, but at the soul level, where we're clear and where we're focused and where we're intentional, that is very powerful. So telepathy can occur there.

Yeah, no, you mentioned how it's instantaneous, and it's like a whole book essentially all at once instead of a word at a time, and that reminded me of Rabbi Alon Anava's near-death experience that he shared. It's a viral video. I'll include it in the show notes for this episode. It's fascinating. And at one point, he was above his body, which was passed at that point. He was in a cab, or the body was in a cab, and he's flying above the cab or being kind of pulled along with his body, just I don't know, some number of feet above the taxi.

Well, at one point, his soul intersects with an apartment building. He goes through that apartment building, and instantaneously, as he's going through that apartment building, he knows all the thoughts of every single occupant, and not only their thoughts and emotions and everything, their entire worldview and life history and where things are going—like all of it, all at once.

Amazing. Yeah, the pre-life review is actually kind of like that too in the pre-incarnate state. It's like an all-at-once review, you know, like two seconds or something is you know how I would compare it to review millions and millions of possibilities of how the life might unfold. Spirit has a huge bandwidth. You know, your ability as a soul—this might be an important thing to lift up—as an individual, your ability to know with a capital K maybe is really big, really wide. It's much bigger and wider than, "Oh, I'm going to think one thought about my sandwich," or "I'm going to think this one philosophical thought today, and now I have the answer." No, much bigger than that.

Yeah, much wider bandwidth.

Yeah, it's like the difference between, I don't know, like a one-bit-at-a-time telegraph versus high-speed, high-bandwidth internet connection.

Exactly. Yeah, it is like that. Spirit's high-speed internet connection is ridiculously big, ridiculously high bandwidth.

Another analogy I like to use is this one: when I was shown the Matrix, this illusion, in the middle of the night on January 22nd, 2021, it was like a terabyte or many terabytes of data being jammed into a 1-gigabyte thumb drive, and of course, I couldn't retain it. So I was like, "Grasp, no, yeah, you can't fit it all in there. It's all gone. Like, I can't retain any of it. I just have the knowing that I saw what the true nature of reality is." So when I was shown the Matrix of how this illusion really works, I couldn't retain it. I know I experienced it, and I was given that glimpse, and it was massive, but it wasn't supported by my current hardware.

No, you got it. No, absolutely. It's like, you know, the human body is like a tuna can. It's just a small, dense, firm thing. It can't fit the Library of Congress, all the books in the tuna can, or even bigger. You can't fit the Earth in a tuna can. You know, that is what it's like. And then we're like, "Oh, but I want to hold on to it." Well, part of what's limiting us actually is all—so there's the physical constraints, there's the non-physical constraints of the veil. Those are important too, but there's another thing going on, which is that we understand reality through crude, clunky, simple forms, very simple from the human point of view. So in order to make sense of what we just received, that third thing can also limit how much we're able to retain and integrate.

Yeah, yeah. So what are some of the non-physical constraints of the veil?

Yeah, so the veil is a set of constraints on consciousness and in consciousness that permit us to focus entirely down into the physical experience. So the veil primarily is an obscuring, like a partitioning maybe, but an obscuring that deeply obscures the memory of all that you are and the conscious access to all the knowing that is in the universe. Those two things—it's pretty much one thing, but the connectedness and the feeling of the live connectedness to everything else.

Yeah, so it obscures those portions of our native being, and that is very, very alien by the way to do that. It's not normal, not common, not typical. Like your right hand not realizing that the left hand is kind of related. Exactly. It's really like, and then when they hurt each other, yeah, and then they're hurting each other, and then you're like, "Oh my gosh, I'm hurting myself. Why are you doing that?" It doesn't make any sense to do that. Love is like that. It doesn't make any sense to hurt anybody else. It just doesn't make any sense.

Yeah, yeah. So the veil is the constraints in consciousness that allow the vibrational focus down into this very low vibration where we don't remember. That's a simple way to describe that, and we believe the illusion of separation.

Yep. Yeah, that's the name of the game: believe the illusion of separation and then learn, integrate, experience through it—not learn intellectually. Well, there's intellectual learning too, but experientially learn through that experience of apparent separation. We've pushed the boundaries really far. This is as far as we've gone so far in the depth of separation. Like, this universe is like super, super separate-feeling.

Yeah, very, very unique, very dense. High, high, high extreme sports for the spirit.

Yeah, we're doing the American Ninja Warrior thing in the universe.

Yes, to put it lightly.

Now, I interviewed a while back a guy named Joe McQuillan who wrote a book about his experience of losing his son and having a psychic connection with that son, and he described what he calls "thin places" where the veil is thinner, such as in his son's room. And there are times as well—he calls that also a thin place—so 3:00 a.m., middle of the night, for him is a thin place, and his son's room is a thin place. So for me, and I think for a lot of people, Jerusalem is a thin place, or even just Israel generally, is one of the thinnest places as far as where the veil between this world and the upper world is thinnest. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on all that.

Sure. I'm not agreeing, but there are no places. So what I mean is that really what you're describing I feel is a vibrational difference. There's a vibrational difference for the meaning, like we were talking about words have vibration. The meaning, the memory of the child's room—that's vibrationally different. Jerusalem, with millions of people having utilized that place in a certain way and pursued the divine through their traditions in that place—that's a vibrational difference.

So it's not so much that there are places and that the veil is a physical thing and it's overlaying all these places, though the physical of course does have its own properties, and I'm not saying there aren't energetic differences between places. There are. I'm just pointing out that really what we're talking about is a shift in vibration, basically. When we're in higher vibration or when we've given ourselves a permission slip in the world of form, we tend to be less—so it's not that the veil is gone.

It's just that we've vibrationally lifted closer to our true nature, and that is if that is a thinner veil because the closer we are vibrationally, the more we have access to, the more we feel, the more we know, the more we can touch. You could say the veil is porous or organic. It's not like it hard-cuts you off. It's just obscuring. All it does is obscure so that you end up focusing on the movie really hard. That's all it does. But if you stop focusing on the movie really hard, then you realize you're in a movie theater, and then you realize you're in a movie theater.

Exactly. Yeah, no, exactly. That's exactly what it is. And you're like, "Oh, well, I'm still veiled," yeah, because, "Man, that movie is really bright," and then get sucked right back in because it's really bright, and it's got your attention. It doesn't have to have your attention. It's just that most people don't typically just, you know, numerically, most people don't typically go and spend the time to meditate every day for years to go find out, to go explore their consciousness beneath all thought.

Yeah, because the thought is part of the movie. You know, it's like, "I'm this. I got to do this," right? Like, I was just at work before this, and I was—my mind was full of many thoughts about work, and I spent 30 minutes meditating and returning to not losing my identity in the thoughts about what?

Good for you. Meditation is so—not that that's easy all the time.

Oh my goodness. The hour flew by.

So if our—well, first of all, you're welcome back anytime. This is a fascinating discussion. So if you want to come back for a part two at any point, I would love to have you.

Thank you, sir. But also, I just—yeah, I love what you're up to in the world. I want to acknowledge you for what you're contributing in terms of revelation of light into the world. And if our listener or viewer wants to learn more from you, where do you want to send them to? Of course, you've got your book and so forth. Maybe a website address or a social media account or something?

Yeah, sure. Yeah, my website is awalkinthephysical.com. The book has the same name, A Walk in the Physical. The website has a book page where the third link down, the entire book is available to be read online for free. It's not about money. I just want to share. And also, that site has a collection of many different talks I've participated in if it's an interesting subject for someone to help.

And regarding the thanks, I want to thank you because, like, you know, you mentioned the love. I can feel your love. It's beautiful, man. You're—I would trust you right off the bat. You're just a trust—really beautiful person. So thank you so much for the work you're doing in the world and your presence. Don't doubt yourself. Let me know if there's any way I can help.

Thank you so much, Christian. And thank you, listener. You too are a light in the world. Go out there and make it a beautiful week. We'll catch you in the next episode. I'm your host, Stefan Spencer, signing off.